Those Sinking

Many Arkansans in prison and/or with children in the child welfare system started their legal engagement with misdemeanor crimes like traffic tickets, driving with no insurance, or theft. Community Diversion in District Courts is a key move to prevent future incarceration and/or foster care. 

In this episode we hear from participants in diversion programs. It is our hope to see the expansion of Community Diversion to all Arkansas District Courts. 

Transcript

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00;00;22;02 - 00;01;00;11
Mykilah Coats
Like it's hard. It's hard to get out of the system. Like, and like, if you talk to just any anybody in the streets that's going through the system, like they'll tell you it's meant to, it feels like is to meant to keep you down. If people are putting forth the effort, then I would, I would give them a chance or like even give some court order to a program that will help them come up and give them the tools they need.

00;01;01;03 - 00;01;13;07
Mykilah Coats
Like, because I know, I know if I wasn't ever court ordered to go to therapy, I would have never went. And that was one of the best decisions, or best things that has ever happened.

00;01;15;24 - 00;01;22;05
Charles Newsome
This is season two episode two of the Smart Justice Podcast: Those who are sinking.

00;01;24;13 - 00;01;30;26
Paul Chapman
Crime and punishment are hot topics. Are there solutions different than what we're hearing about the national level?

00;01;31;00 - 00;01;38;11
Judge Amy Grimes
They're trying to stop that cycle so that we don't see their children. They don't see them in juvenile court. We don't see them headed to circuit court.

00;01;38;20 - 00;01;42;15
Paul Chapman
We give someone a traffic ticket and they're scared they can't pay their ticket.

00;01;42;15 - 00;01;45;20
Chief Jamie Hammond
And what they do is they don't show for court. I think it's going to go away. Well it doesn’t go away.

00;01;45;22 - 00;01;52;03
Judge Charles Baker
It's not about the court bringing in that money. It's about helping that person avoid this kind of problem in the future.

00;01;52;03 - 00;01;57;17
Paul Chapman
There is a different way to approach justice that has better return on investment.

00;01;57;18 - 00;02;00;04
Sheriff Phillip Miller
The bad people need to be in jail and stay there. Folks that are suffering from just social ills, they dont’ need to be here.

00;02;00;13 - 00;02;13;02
Paul Chapman
That seems to strengthen both law enforcement and courts and tie that together with community resources.

00;02;13;07 - 00;02;21;19
Judge Amy Grimes
That's what makes it worthwhile. That little bit of extra time you spend working on it. But if you can't do a little mercy when you're here, then it's not worth being here.

00;02;21;19 - 00;02;31;04
Paul Chapman
And then track the impact to communities and better outcomes. And we're calling this approach Smart Justice.

00;02;32;27 - 00;02;50;25
Ed Lowry
Smart Justice is a work of Restore Hope and partner organizations. Restore Hope is a software and services organization that helps communities achieve better outcomes for justice and child welfare efforts. Smart Justice is focused on optimizing the system by improving the relationships among its parts.

00;02;53;20 - 00;03;08;21
Charles Newsome
In this season of Smart Justice, we're going upstream to see how to assist people out of the justice system before they get too deep. How does that work for the people who needing the help? Paul Chapman, director of Restore Hope.

00;03;10;00 - 00;03;41;20
Paul Chapman
Hey, in this episode of the Smart Justice Podcast, we're going to have the opportunity to hear from many clients who were assisted in district court in helping them deal with their issues. And so we're here with Dana Baker. Dana is the coordinator for 100 Families in White County. But Dana you actually started all this work with Restore Hope by being the one who helped Judge Derrick in White County set up community diversion programs in district court there.

00;03;41;24 - 00;03;42;28
Paul Chapman
How long ago was that?

00;03;42;28 - 00;03;44;17
Dana Baker
Five years the 1st of November.

00;03;45;03 - 00;03;54;07
Paul Chapman
Five years. So and and now you're no longer in the court, but you have staff that are in the court on a regular basis.

00;03;54;15 - 00;03;57;17
Dana Baker
We have a case manager in every district courtroom in White County.

00;03;58;13 - 00;04;05;18
Paul Chapman
Just, you know, what's your reflection on the opportunity the district courts provide to actually meet and help people?

00;04;06;06 - 00;04;32;13
Dana Baker
One thing I think that has really made a profound impact on what I even do now is just watching people receive the opportunity to connect to services. Often I think that they haven't known where to turn and what the first steps would be. Would they have everything they need? It's sometimes it's scary to approach mental health services or recovery, and they don't know what that looks like.

00;04;32;13 - 00;04;55;01
Dana Baker
And so to have someone that's going to connect them to those resources, make sure that they get those appointments with the appropriate place and help them just navigate what it means to make that first step has been really impactful on even what I do now in White County, just removing everything that has kept them from getting those services before and making sure that it works.

00;04;56;15 - 00;05;00;08
Charles Newsome
Traci Davison connected with 100 Families in district court.

00;05;01;12 - 00;05;15;19
Traci Davidson
I had had an open DCFS case. I had recently had gotten DWI, went to court with George Derrick and he appointed me to 100 Families.

00;05;15;28 - 00;05;22;21
Paul Chapman
What was the conversation like this you just sitting there in court having a conversation? Why in the world did you decide to work with them?

00;05;23;22 - 00;05;42;29
Traci Davidson
When they see you, they see something in you immediately and it gives you reassurance in yourself. And they just tell you, you know, how they can work with you to build your self and build your future for where you're trying to go instead of just trying to set you more and more back.

00;05;44;12 - 00;05;50;04
Paul Chapman
What what was that like? You're in court and you've got DCFS case. I would imagine that’d be a little overwhelming?

00;05;50;10 - 00;06;15;08
Traci Davidson
It was. Working with them was a breath of fresh air. Really. It was like you always had someone on your side. It was like having a family without having family. They were always there to help remind you of things or give you resources that you didn't know about. Or in certain situations, plug you, you know, just whatever you needed.

00;06;15;08 - 00;06;29;24
Traci Davidson
They were there. They're pretty much your personal cheerleader. Like, just encouragement to keep going and always trying to find a solution to help and plug you into great resources. Really.

00;06;30;01 - 00;06;32;02
Paul Chapman
What resources did you get connected with?

00;06;32;26 - 00;06;39;21
Traci Davidson
I went to college through Career Pathways and used. Um.

00;06;40;02 - 00;06;41;20
Paul Chapman
What are you studying?

00;06;42;08 - 00;06;55;16
Traci Davidson
I studied diesel technologies. I graduated in May. I currently attend for my associate who applied science Business Technologies.

00;06;57;11 - 00;07;10;27
Paul Chapman
Let's talk details around what actually happens in court. I mean, are you are you or your folks are they actually in the courtroom or and what do you do when you're in the courtroom?

00;07;10;27 - 00;07;36;09
Dana Baker
So all of our all the district courtrooms have a case manager that works with 100 Families. And the alternatives, and community diversion program now is under the umbrella of 100 Families, Every one of the district courtrooms and every court that meets every week, the case manager is there. They are in front of the wall. They're right there with the attorneys, with the ad, with probation officers.

00;07;36;18 - 00;07;38;06
Dana Baker
They're right there on the front lines.

00;07;38;06 - 00;07;41;25
Paul Chapman
And so you've developed kind of relationship. Y'all all know each other, and.

00;07;42;00 - 00;08;11;22
Dana Baker
It's become really a team between even the bailiffs and the jailers and all those that are involved in the proceedings every day of court. Our team is right there in the front accessible to the judge, accessible to the prosecutor, or even to the public defender if they want to talk about a client. And so kind of what happens is every litigant will come up to the podium and the judge looks at their charges and says, do you have kids under 18?

00;08;11;22 - 00;08;32;29
Dana Baker
Which is one of the determinants that we have to have for our program. And then he says, go over and talk to 100 families. I think they might have some ways they can help. And at that point the client sits down with the case manager. They ask a few questions, explain what we do, explain how it can benefit them for the rest of their life, and then explain how it can benefit them in the courtroom.

00;08;33;14 - 00;08;39;22
Paul Chapman
So what does is conversation like? Let's say that I just came over. I'm nervous. And the judge said, come, come talk to you?

00;08;40;02 - 00;08;49;22
Dana Baker
So the first thing we do is sometimes they're they're afraid because the judge says, hey, do you have kids? And so sometimes that scares them. And so I have to say, this is not about your they're.

00;08;49;22 - 00;08;50;12
Paul Chapman
Scared of what.

00;08;50;25 - 00;09;09;18
Dana Baker
The DHS is going to be involved because these asked about their children. And so we just explain, hey, it's just we have to make sure you have kids. That's how we're funded. But it's not about your kids. This is about your recovery, your criminal issues that you have going on, mental health issues that you may have going on.

00;09;09;28 - 00;09;27;28
Dana Baker
We want to help you want to support you and advocate for you. But we want to be able to connect to resources that are going to make a difference. If you accept that help, the judge is going to bring you back up to the podium today. He's going to reset your case for 4 to 6 months. He's going to see you again.

00;09;27;28 - 00;09;51;00
Dana Baker
I'll be here with you and we'll report to the judge what you did in that six months. It just kind of calms them down, helps them understand what's happening. And then if they look like or they feel like that's something they might want, then the case manager goes into more detail. What's your substance abuse history? I see that some of your charges are possession charges.

00;09;51;09 - 00;09;53;14
Dana Baker
I see it's your second possession charge.

00;09;54;24 - 00;09;58;25
Paul Chapman
So the case manager has the docket available.

00;09;59;21 - 00;10;18;28
Dana Baker
Even before the court starts. We're able to look through that docket and know who some good clients would be, someone that we might need to meet before we leave there that day. Someone who has several they're on several dockets. They may be in a different city next week as well. And so we know this is a history that they have.

00;10;19;06 - 00;10;47;28
Dana Baker
They probably would benefit from not only the services but the community diversion opportunities. And so we make the best connection that we can with the charges that we know will have high sentencing. Lots of jail time high fines where it's going to be something to entice them to try therapy for the first time or to try substance abuse services for the first time.

00;10;47;28 - 00;10;55;18
Charles Newsome
Chase Stillman was facing a number of charges and fines related to his history with addiction.

00;10;55;18 - 00;11;22;28
Chase Stillman
I had been battling meth addiction for some time. It had actually started with opiates. And, you know, when they got harder to find, it just blossomed from there. So I had been in and out of jail running from the law for like seven years. And I hadn't had a driver's license in seven years. And you look over your shoulder everywhere you go, you second guess anywhere you're going to go, even if it's for your children or your wife, it doesn't matter.

00;11;23;06 - 00;11;25;28
Chase Stillman
You're always worried about, well, what if this is the time?

00;11;25;28 - 00;11;36;17
Charles Newsome
Say so to help 100 Families and found an ally in case manager Jaimi Zeringue, who helped guide him through the process of the system and working with his probation officer.

00;11;37;08 - 00;11;56;06
Chase Stillman
It was a slow process for me. Like I said, I had seven warrants. We knocked out a couple of them and then at that point I couldn't get any further because my felony was holding me back. And so it really took a leap of faith on my part at that point, because I had had some trouble with my probation officer and everything in the past.

00;11;56;23 - 00;12;08;00
Chase Stillman
And so when I guess just whenever I went and did it, I was so nervous, so scared. And she was like, “Don't be. Everything's going to be fine.” She was never negative, not once, and I low and behold here I am.

00;12;08;01 - 00;12;12;16
Paul Chapman
And so what was that like when you were going to your probation officer?

00;12;13;03 - 00;12;32;15
Chase Stillman
You know? Well, the first time it was nerve wracking, you know, because he if he wanted to, he could have locked me back up no matter how clean or how good I was doing. It was his his deal. And so when I met him, I took my drug test and I passed. You know, everything went from there that first time, you know, he was a little standoffish.

00;12;32;15 - 00;12;41;13
Chase Stillman
But after that, he's been really cool and so he just wants me to do right. And I see that I used to blame them back then and but I could see it was me, not them.

00;12;42;06 - 00;12;48;19
Paul Chapman
Yeah. So what made you kind of take that leap of faith almost to go in?

00;12;49;04 - 00;13;09;23
Chase Stillman
Well, when I was in my addiction, I lost my children. They went to live with my my wife's grandparents. And once I got clean, we started getting visitation back and they come and they started living with us or not living with us, staying with us on the weekends. And then so I talked to Jaimi. I was like, Look, we want our kids home.

00;13;10;08 - 00;13;33;12
Chase Stillman
And so at that point I had to get on a roll with it. And once I started, though, I didn't stop. It was scary and I hated it. But I just, you know, right through it because it was better to do it that way, because if I wouldn't have, I could have gotten I don't know, half of them took care of, got picked up on one right back and there was no charges.

00;13;33;12 - 00;13;39;13
Chase Stillman
And so, you know, that that was the biggest kicker, you know, getting me to start it.

00;13;42;14 - 00;13;51;06
Charles Newsome
To help people like Chase, 100 Families caseworkers in the court look for opportunities to meet people before court is in session.

00;13;51;06 - 00;14;53;06
Paul Chapman
So you get the docket before court and you're doing kind of homework, you're doing prep work. And so kind of talk us through what what the docket looks like.

00;14;53;07 - 00;15;11;28
Dana Baker
So each of the court clerks mails us the docket is way ahead of time. The case manager in the office will look over that. She'll first look for clients that are already in our program that have a court date. She'll let them know they have a court date coming up, and then she'll make notes. They've graduated. They haven't shown up.

00;15;12;04 - 00;15;28;26
Dana Baker
They need a little more time. Can we set this out 4 to 6 weeks, Something like that. So those are clients that are already established. We use Hope Ark our case management system to keep up with all those notes. And then the second thing we do is we look to see who we might be meeting in court that day.

00;15;29;03 - 00;15;57;28
Dana Baker
We're looking for charges like possession of controlled substances, possession of drug paraphernalia, a lot of failure to pay. It means that they have a history of for some reason, they may be fearful to come back to court to make a payment arrangement. They may have a failure to appear several of those, if they show up that day. We want to help them understand how making better decisions in the court, even showing up to court, would benefit them in the future.

00;15;57;28 - 00;16;00;06
Dana Baker
And they often need mental health and substance abuse.

00;16;00;06 - 00;16;07;24
Paul Chapman
That's why when someone gets a failure to appear, then what happens once you have an FTA?

00;16;07;24 - 00;16;45;04
Dana Baker
Sure. Failure to appear and failure to pay, you're basically not going to have the same charges in the same sentences. Those things are going to snowball on you and you're going to be out of control. You're going to owe a lot of money, you're going to have a lot of jail time you have to serve. And if we can stop some of those and help them to address that ahead on and we're in the courtroom to advocate and support them as they do, address the judge and help explain them, have explained to them what's happened and why this is all snowballed and they really are ready to kind of conquer it more when we lay

00;16;45;04 - 00;17;12;17
Dana Baker
it out in a simple way. They're not so afraid to approach the judge the next time. We also look for things like probation violations. If they have a probation violation, the same thing, helping them understand what they got that what are you trying to avoid? Let's get reconnected to your probation officer. Let's sit down together with him and once make a plan and get the substance abuse and mental health services that you need.

00;17;13;07 - 00;17;18;21
Charles Newsome
Mikala Coats found the redirection she needed through her connection with 100 families.

00;17;19;16 - 00;17;40;17
Mykilah Coats
I had just caught a slew of charges. Is I was looking at six years in penitentiary and I lost my job because I was locked up. I lost my driver's license. I had just sold my car just so I could pay the bills.

00;17;41;05 - 00;17;52;15
Paul Chapman
What motivated you to get out and because that is a pretty proactive step, a lot of times when when folks are kind of under the gun like you were, it just makes me want to curl up and.

00;17;53;17 - 00;18;22;25
Mykilah Coats
You can’t do that. You can't do that. I mean, like the problems are still going to be there at the end of the day. That's kind of like when you go and get high, you're trying to escape something, you're trying to escape reality. But when you come down from that, everything's still going to be there, if not worse, because you don't know what you done screwed up when you was high. Cause you didn't care.

00;18;22;25 - 00;18;46;19
Mykilah Coats
Yeah, no emotions for anybody. And like, if I can go that hard in the streets, I can go that hard sober. If not, plus, you know. Like my son’s my world by. And I know, like, if I didn't get my life together, I was going to lose full custody. I was going to loose every right to the state of Arkansas.

00;18;47;27 - 00;18;53;10
Paul Chapman
You had a whole bunch of misdemeanor crimes and you had a suspension or.

00;18;53;20 - 00;19;20;07
Mykilah Coats
Yeah, I got my driver's license suspended. So when you get pulled over, I got charged with a DWI driving while intoxicated on drugs. For that first year of sobriety, and like, that first year, like, I worked two jobs just to pay the bills and pay my fines. Like I had guidance from 100 Families by through the whole thing.

00;19;20;07 - 00;19;35;02
Mykilah Coats
And any time like I felt down, like I knew I could go and talk to them, like get some solid advice, I was able to do a lot of my community service up there at 100 Families.

00;19;36;16 - 00;19;38;12
Paul Chapman
So you got your driver's license back?

00;19;38;12 - 00;19;41;07
Mykilah Coats
Yes. Yes, I got my driver's license back.

00;19;41;20 - 00;19;44;14
Paul Chapman
Are you you owe any more on fees and fines?

00;19;44;14 - 00;19;52;04
Mykilah Coats
Everything's paid off. I got it all paid off within the first year.

00;19;52;04 - 00;20;07;01
Paul Chapman
So let's talk, Dana, just as... taking the devil's advocate role here. If... why couldn't, the client just, you know, address their issues. Why do we need to have a case manager? Can't someone just fix it?

00;20;07;25 - 00;20;25;22
Dana Baker
Sure. So I get asked this question a lot, but I feel like we're changing the whole mindset in our community where people are more aware of all of the obstacles that revolve around that. So in order for someone to apply for any public assistance, whether it's for housing, whether it's for SNAP or it's even what.

00;20;25;22 - 00;20;26;18
Paul Chapman
SNAP for those.

00;20;26;24 - 00;20;54;28
Dana Baker
Food stamps Supplemental Nutrition Program. So any of these resources, even if it's short term housing into a homeless shelter, they're going to have to have a form of I.D. They need a state issued I.D., a birth certificate, Social Security card. And often our clients are coming out of jail. They don't know where those documents are. So even if they had those, it's still hard to access those services.

00;20;55;05 - 00;21;13;14
Dana Baker
But that's where we start. We start at the ground level. What are you going to have to have before you can move on to the next thing? So we're helping them address every single barrier. They don't know which therapist is best. They've heard about a therapist, but it might have been at a Celebrate Recovery program where they heard about it.

00;21;13;23 - 00;21;30;16
Dana Baker
Who are they? Where do they work? What's the phone number? Do I qualify as that? What I need is it inpatient? Is it outpatient? Is it going to cost me money? Do it. Do I have to go inpatient and leave my kids? Who's going to watch my kids? So let's just talk through everything that can prevent them to be connected to those resources.

00;21;30;18 - 00;21;59;29
Dana Baker
Oftentimes, the paperwork is overwhelming. Oftentimes, a lot of these programs want you to apply online. Our clients don't have computers, laptops, Wi-Fi access, and so helping them to access this. And we don't work harder than our clients, we just remove the obstacles. I'm not going to sit there and fill out a 45 page housing application for them, but I am going to either hand it to them in paper or hand them a laptop in our office with our WiFi and help them to fill that out.

00;22;00;10 - 00;22;25;13
Dana Baker
And then I'm going to make a note and help out to the care team member and say, Application mailed, application submitted. Now what? These are the things that your parent helps you with. Your big sister helps you with, your best friend helps you with, your spouse helps you with. Our families don't have those traditional support methods. So they had not been taught by a parent about how to apply for those things.

00;22;25;13 - 00;22;47;05
Dana Baker
They knew their parents had those they knew, but they also knew it was frustrating and sometimes their parents SNAP was cut off or they sometimes were homeless themselves. But how did they get out of that? They didn't get out of it. They never watched their parents successfully navigate that. And so for us to support and navigate that with them is all that makes a difference then.

00;22;47;05 - 00;22;53;22
Paul Chapman
And we've talked about Hope Ark and the software that you're making notes. And let's just talk a little bit about what Hope Ark is.

00;22;53;26 - 00;23;27;17
Dana Baker
Sure. Hope Ark is a collective impact case management system that Restore Hope uses. I call it social work Facebook. It's just a real it's a running story of what is going on in our clients lives, positive and negative. And within that case management system, you have a care team. So not only are they being connected to mental health and substance abuse providers, but as they stabilize in those two areas, we're adding on education partners, employment partners, parenting centers, housing partners.

00;23;27;26 - 00;23;31;27
Dana Baker
We're adding on financial planners, people that help them make a budget.

00;23;31;28 - 00;23;39;15
Paul Chapman
So these people, as they're added on, actually are on the case. And so that's the Facebook part is you're able to communicate.

00;23;39;15 - 00;23;56;25
Dana Baker
Yeah. So those people are my job as the coordinator is to make sure that in all 14 of the areas that we serve families in the 14 social determinants of health, that we have multiple partners in our county that are serving those families in those areas. So if.

00;23;56;28 - 00;23;59;08
Paul Chapman
They're on the case management system, they're.

00;23;59;08 - 00;24;10;04
Dana Baker
Trained in there, it's in the system. How to use the system. They receive a notification via email every time they're added to your team. It's almost instant that they can connect to a family.

00;24;10;13 - 00;24;18;03
Paul Chapman
So let's talk about that, those social determinants of health. That's an assessment that that y'all do. What does that assessment look like?

00;24;18;06 - 00;24;42;04
Dana Baker
So this assessment that's in 14 crisis areas, it's built into the Hope Ark system. We asked specific questions in all 14 areas. For instance, with housing, we're asking where are you sleeping today? Are you sleeping on a couch? Are you sleeping outside? And so if they are in crisis in housing, they're homeless or they're couch surfing, then they're rated at a one.

00;24;42;04 - 00;24;57;20
Dana Baker
We immediately add a care team partner, whether it's a homeless shelter or the local homeless tent city. And so we're adding partners based on the level of need. I have partners from one all the way up to five, and.

00;24;58;06 - 00;25;11;28
Paul Chapman
So that's a spectrum. And I would imagine that that could be fluid in the way that y'all are providing services as someone could could reach stability. But then something could happen, right? And you could fall back into crisis.

00;25;11;28 - 00;25;30;09
Dana Baker
So all of those questions that I just mentioned about housing, those are asked again every month. Okay. So our client may be renting a house with a friend. And so they're about at a three or four and then they get into an argument or they lose their lease or their friend loses their job, so they lose their house.

00;25;30;09 - 00;25;47;26
Dana Baker
So next month they're going to be at a one again. So we're constantly looking at how their lives are changing, their situations are changing. And all 14 of those crisis areas and a lot of us, a lot of times those things will snowball. They've lost their job, then they're going to lose their house and then they're going to lose their kids.

00;25;48;10 - 00;25;54;12
Dana Baker
And so if we're re addressing these things every month, we're able to stay on top of things and fight.

00;25;54;12 - 00;25;56;29
Paul Chapman
In White County How many clients are you currently serving?

00;25;57;03 - 00;26;04;03
Dana Baker
We're currently serving between 280 and 320. It fluctuates, but that's been the average this year.

00;26;04;11 - 00;26;06;00
Paul Chapman
And how long does a client stay with you?

00;26;06;21 - 00;26;32;23
Dana Baker
Oh, my goodness. I don't really know the answer to that. I know we don't dismiss them unless we can't contact them so they can stay in the program as long as they want our services. A lot of families will actually go before the judge and alternative sentencing programs and graduate the program. But then they'll say to the judge, Your Honor, I know that your graduating me today, I won't see you anymore, but I'm going to stick with 100 Families.

00;26;32;23 - 00;26;58;02
Dana Baker
And so the more they stabilize and the more they're able to address mental health and substance issues, then the more they're ready to receive education opportunities that are employment opportunities. Getting some of those driver's license issues, address saving up money to buy a car, getting better housing. We want to continue to work with them as long as we can to bring them to career.

00;26;58;12 - 00;27;09;05
Dana Baker
Career is money in the bank, bond a house off of all public assistance. So to me, that's 3 to 4 years or more, from crisis to stability.

00;27;09;05 - 00;27;38;04
Chase Stillman
So, you know, I had seven warrants. I have none. All of them are gone. Thank you. I have I've went to six court dates in the last two months. I have two more to go, one this month and then one after the first of the year. And as long as when I go to the one that the first year is my felony one, and as long as I can make the judge happy, then he should just reinstate my probation, which according to my probation officer, I'm well on my way of doing that.

00;27;38;18 - 00;27;52;28
Chase Stillman
I'm making the payments. I'm visiting him once a month, passing all my drug tests and all of that. I've got a job, we've got a house. Our kids are back home full time, you know, So life has really changed and I couldn't be more grateful.

00;27;53;09 - 00;28;11;18
Mykilah Coats
I have graduated welding school. I went through CIC. I signed up that 100 families. I went through CIC and got my welding, which I learned how to stick weld there and I've learned how to MIG weld on the job.

00;28;12;10 - 00;28;14;12
Paul Chapman
Why in the world did you want to get a welding school?

00;28;14;29 - 00;28;49;17
Mykilah Coats
Well, after you? So I was in the medical field for several years. And I was in the process of starting to get my paramedic. And when you catch drug felony charges, you cannot work in the medical field as long as that is on your record. And so I sat back and I was reevaluating everything. And I grew up around welders. So my dad's a welder, my uncle’s a welder, my brother's a welder.

00;28;50;19 - 00;29;17;04
Mykilah Coats
And you know, I was like, they make good money. And so I was like, I'm a do it, I'm a learn My dad was completely against it. He’s like, no I don't want that for my daughter. That's a rough lifestyle. Like, you also don't want a child to be a drug addict. So here we are. Here we are. And this is what we are going to go for.

00;29;17;11 - 00;29;47;12
Mykilah Coats
And now I am making more money than I ever thought I would, especially like a year ago, two years ago, I never thought I would be where I'm at today. Like, I'm I'm actually building my own house. I bought a piece of property, building, like I've put in electricity, the sewer, the water. We're building the house like me and my dad.

00;29;47;12 - 00;29;51;00
Mykilah Coats
We're building it ourselves.

00;29;51;00 - 00;29;58;17
Paul Chapman
So when you're offering help and someone wants it, you're in the court and you make an appointment for them. How many actually keep the appointment?

00;29;59;07 - 00;30;10;12
Dana Baker
We're looking at about 75% right now. We often will call and remind them you've got an appointment coming up. We'll give them another opportunity if they need to reschedule that. But worried about 75%.

00;30;10;27 - 00;30;20;21
Paul Chapman
Of those that actually, you know, start down the road, they get the full assessment and you're connecting them. How many actually satisfy their outstanding legal obligations?

00;30;20;24 - 00;30;22;15
Dana Baker
I would say we're probably at the same amount.

00;30;22;20 - 00;30;24;04
Paul Chapman
About 75% of those that start then complete.

00;30;24;19 - 00;30;43;21
Dana Baker
Yeah. There may there may be some we call them false starts. They may slip back for a little while. They may have some fears that they may get put in jail somewhere else on another charge. And so there also are some false starts. But we just try to continue to reconnect them and we don't give up until they've made that that first attempt.

00;30;44;05 - 00;31;08;21
Paul Chapman
You know, just watching you over in White County and what's going on in both Sebastian and Crawford counties where we are seeing this community diversion, too, I kind of think of it as a an investment we're making to prevent, you know, more much more expensive and much more socially costly things like kids going into foster care, parents going into jail and or prison.

00;31;09;18 - 00;31;19;02
Paul Chapman
Well, you know, just tell me what your experience has been over the past five years with specifically with that as these are interventions kind of upstream.

00;31;19;12 - 00;31;39;28
Dana Baker
We'll never know how many cases we've prevented, foster care cases like prevented. But I do know that there have been a lot of families that have come in that have had investigations or protective services cases and we’re able to intervene on the beginning of those proceedings, and just kind of help them, again, navigate that. What does that mean when DHS shows up at your door?

00;31;40;06 - 00;32;01;24
Dana Baker
What's going to happen next? And so we're able to kind of walk through that with them as well and then to let DCF know through the use of Hope Ark and the care team, they are connecting to these services. They have started substance abuse classes. They have been going to parenting classes. And so, again, the quick connection to resources, I think, is what makes the difference.

00;32;01;29 - 00;32;06;16
Paul Chapman
Okay. So the Court and the prosecutor, y'all were all working together?

00;32;06;21 - 00;32;07;12
Dana Baker
Absolutely.

00;32;07;17 - 00;32;12;05
Paul Chapman
Is there any opposition to this or is there kind of consensus on.

00;32;12;25 - 00;32;22;00
Dana Baker
Well, you know, I had to get the by you in the beginning. So the judge agreed to let us come into the courtroom. Several people were skeptical years ago.

00;32;22;00 - 00;32;22;22
Paul Chapman
I would imagine prosecutor.

00;32;22;22 - 00;32;51;00
Dana Baker
Prosecutors were skeptical. Police officers were skeptical. Police chiefs were skeptical in the beginning. They didn't understand what we were trying to accomplish. But as they sat there and been silent witnesses to what's happened with our clients, they've watched as they have completed programs, they're passing drug screens. They've been a witness to people that have been in these courts for years.

00;32;51;00 - 00;32;51;23
Paul Chapman
They see it working.

00;32;51;27 - 00;33;13;14
Dana Baker
They see it working. And so now when they call us to make a referral or we had a police chief bring someone to us a few weeks ago who wouldn't have done that four years ago, they really have watched it work. They had to get the buy in for sure and and see it actually happen in lives of people that they were dealing with on the streets.

00;33;13;23 - 00;33;28;03
Dana Baker
Sometimes they had dealt with their parents and grandparents as well. And so now they're seeing those lives change through an opportunity they got in a courtroom when they weren't expecting it. And so I cannot think of anyone honestly in White County right now that is not on board.

00;33;29;07 - 00;33;42;28
Paul Chapman
So what would your message then be to a community that that's looking at kind of they're considering this? What would your message be to the judge, the police chief, to the nonprofits that are there?

00;33;43;15 - 00;33;54;20
Dana Baker
What's to loose? You can only gain a stronger community and you can only have better outcomes when you all work together. And I don't think there's anything to lose here.

00;33;54;23 - 00;34;11;19
Paul Chapman
What would you say to someone maybe that's really struggling right now? Kids that are at home and they had speeding ticket they didn't pay and and they're starting to look at they're starting to lose hope. Do you have... What would you say to them?

00;34;13;07 - 00;34;35;16
Dana Baker
To definitely reach out to 100 families. They have a lot of resources. I can't tell you how many times I've sent people to 100 families, but definitely reach out. Talk to courts If you can't talk to anybody else. I know it gets overwhelming sometimes and it feels like they don't listen. But as long as you're persistent. If you don't speak, they're not going to hear you.

00;34;37;04 - 00;35;15;22
Mykilah Coats
Say, especially unless you've got the drive to get out of it. When you've got that many fines, 10,000 plus fines, and then you've got your bills and you're a single mom, you've got to take care of the kids and you only are able to obtain a minimum wage job like that's a lot of stress. Like for when you're in that situation, it's great to have other other outlet, like other options.

00;35;16;22 - 00;35;41;06
Mykilah Coats
That way you are succeeding. You feel like you're succeeding and you're getting somewhere and like that, that mistake you made isn't going to define who you are.

00;35;41;06 - 00;35;59;12
Charles Newsome
Thank you for joining us for this episode of Smart Justice. Join us next episode as we look at the impact of sentencing alternative from the perspective of the law and lawyers. Should it be interesting. See you then?

00;35;59;12 - 00;36;24;26
Chief Jamie Hammond
Thanks to our guests Dana Baker, Traci Davidson, Chase Stillman and Mikayla Coates. And thanks to Arkansas Churches for Life for sponsoring. Musical credits include “Lonely Company” by Anthony Catacoli, “Tangles” by Aaron Sprinkle, “Light the Way” by Ian Kelosky, “Better Than I Was Yesterday” by Anthony Catacoli, “Holy Ground” by Cody Martin. Music is licensed through soundstripe.com. Smart Justice is a work of Restore Hope.

00;36;25;11 - 00;36;59;22
Chief Jamie Hammond
Please Consider helping us produce more work like this by becoming a sponsor www.smartjustice.org